Posted by tyan (Singapore, Singapore) on 16 February 2008 in Food & Cuisine.
Yesterday i was pleasantly surprised to receive a jar of homemade cookies from the mom of Caleb's classmate,Amber,to thank me for the photos i took for her daughter.I have not been able to join a mommies' support group in my church as much as i want to,so the kindy has become a place where i interact with other mommies,no deep and personal conversations,but at least i know i am not parenting in insolation. But most of the time,the people waiting outside are maids or grandparents,so mommies are a rare species too.
Just out of curiosity,can i ask my AM3 friends whether most women quit their jobs after having kids to stay home in your country?And why?
the cookies look so yum. and how aptly placed in a nutella jar.
i think in Singapore (where I am from as well), most mothers would quit their jobs to stay home and take care of their kids because we dont really trust the quality and level of care provided by domestic helpers be it local or foreign helpers (ie maids). Also, I think it also creates a bond with the child. Not such a good idea for the kid to be more sticky to the nanny or maid, you reckon? And also, it's probably a culture thing. Westerners usually would hire nannys and babysitters but we Asians would rather watch our kids ourselves because we dont trust foreign maids (think of the horrible abuse reported in the news in recent years).
Glad you're getting on well with the rest of the mommies.
16 Feb 2008 12:08am
@Tricia: hi dearie,thanks for taking time to reply..honestly,after staying at home for slightly more than a year,i actually do not think most women here would quit their jobs to stay home.Because if that is true,i should have more friends!!haha.On a more serious note,i think the converse is true.As in,most would return to work and arrange alternate childcare for their kids,childcare centres,grandparents,maids,nannies..childcare centres here are sprouting out at a phenomenal rate!The standard of living in Singapore is too high.[I am seriously not impressed with the new Budget]Its so tough that i see the need to do some home tutoring to supplement our income.Its hard not to work,the social stigma of stayin home,the money that working brings,the powerful marketing packages that childcare centres have to offer today,the over-glorified hot working mama in powersuit who claims to balance work-life so well....anyway,thats the way it is living in singapore.Let me know if there are greener pastures elsewhere,the grass over here is not even edible,haha.
Mm they look delicious! :)
16 Feb 2008 1:02am
I'd like a cookie. Actually many of the women in Slovakia get long-term maternity leave when they have children. They might go back to their job after two or three years or even longer.
16 Feb 2008 2:16am
@Michael Skorulski: thank you for taking time to reply,Michael,that is nice. We are not so fortunate here. Women who take leav beyond 3 months usually get the sack.If they work in the civil service,they have a higher chance of taking longer leave but government policies are obviously silently disapproving stay home moms,such as higher subsidies to working moms,new on experts encouraging women to leave home,find work and leave their children at the childcare to boost the economy.Everything here is measured in dollars and cents.Perhaps it is inevitable.Somehow there is a stigma to moms staying home,and general disapproval.Perhaps it is because we are a country without rich natural resources and highly dependent on labour.Anyway,thanks for sharing.
I see that your photography is bringining in edible benefits for you! Cookies are a good thing. To answer your question, many Kenyan women in America have no choice but to go to work and leave their kids at a child care place or with relatives. I really think that a mothers care is far more better than child care but it is so hard to be with the kids while bills have to be paid. So if i had a choice, i would have my future wife stay at home with the kids while i go hunt and gather (work).
16 Feb 2008 4:32am
@Rags: thank you for sharing,Kanyi.I know you are going to be a wonderful husband.Some of my friends' husbands actually dont support their wives to stay at home because they do not want to bear the full responsibility of bringing home the bacon or that they want to maintain a certain standard of living.I understand what you are saying,many women have no choice but to work because they could be single parents or that they struggle to put bread on the table.But in my country,most have a choice.Its just the kind of lifestyle that one wants to live.Most people actually have the idea that the women who stay home have very rich husbands and do nothing but shop and eat all day.In a sense,those who are really poor wont be able to stay home,but there are some who stay home but are not rich at all.When i was a working mom,we used to be considered as 'middle income' family,now,we actually belong to the lower 50 percentile of the income group.Please do not misunderstand,i am not trying to over-glorify stay at home moms,but i feel a lot because while i am worrying myself to death about our financial situation and working part time to make ends meet,there are people who disapprove and criticize me for staying at home and not getting a 'regular' job and helping my husband to bear the financial burden.Let's just say we have different priorities.They tell me that staying at home is for women whose husbands earn pots of money.They do not give me any encouragement for making the sacrifice of giving up my job,recognition and feeling of worth tied to work, but they tell me that I am doing the stupidest thing on earth by staying at home. That i have got to be the perfect mother who takes good care of their children,makes sure they are well fed,well taken care of,to be the perfect wife who serves her husband head to toe,as well as the one who can also bring home the money.In Singapore,stay at home moms are marginalized and penalized for staying at home. Some are rich,true, but not all. Not all. But they just have different priorities and concerns from society,from the norm,and they have to pay quite a heavy price to be different.Thanks once again,for sharing,forgive my ranting here.:)
Amber's daughter is beautiful. The cookies are yum-looking. If I had a daughter, I would want to stay at home with her.
16 Feb 2008 11:20am
Good holder! I like your 'everyday' shots! These are simple and professional!
16 Feb 2008 2:15pm
wow.... That's so nice of her.... Where I stand, most women tend to go back to their jobs after their *very long* maternity leave, although some women who still value tradition will give up their jobs. personally, my mum gave her job up to raise me, and that isn't exactly a bad thing. ^^
16 Feb 2008 6:46pm
Gosh I should get friends like Amber =) I can certainly understand and appreciate the perspective you're coming from. I can't say I fully do given my chronological youth (23) and the fact that I am a male (and hence have different role expecations). However, I strongly agree with the issue that stay-at-home mothers/wives are penalized for the role they play (whether by choice or not) and all the more so in an high inflation/pressure environment like Singapore. This is a rather sad by-product of the environment and economy that Singapore has benefited from. My personal view on the subject, as a Singaporean male, is to earn as much money as I can to provide for all my family needs and wants. Consequently, should my future life partner choose to not work and focus on the kids, she can have the liberty to do so. It's a rather simplistic stance to take and I realise this particular pathway may not be an option for many people. However, should my wife choose to work, it's A-okay with me too. The principal consideration for me in this case is in making sure that as parents, first and foremost, that in the pursuit of material resources, we do not neglect our children. Material goods like a nice home or liquid assests in the bank are primarily there to ensure the financial security of the family and to enable our children to have a better future - to load the dice for them if you will.
In this respect, I completely agree with your statement that everything in Singapore (and for most of the faster-paced developed world) is measured in terms of dollars and sense. What Singaporeans (and alot of other people too) don't see is the non-monetary benefits that stay-at-home-moms provide in terms of improving the whole family dynamic. Simply because home mommies don't produce a positive income statement doesn't mean that their roles are useless. On the contrary, I feel that (like Tricia) such mommies generally provide for their family and more specifically their children with a more wholesome developmental environment. And that is priceless - especially when considering the metaissue of preloading the dice for your children.
That said however, I am a product of a working mom. My mom's a teacher and a pretty darn good one at that. She's one of those seasoned veterans of the MOE. I was taken care of by my maid but I was raised by my mom. That is one important distinction that I feel many working moms these days forget and hence give stay-at-home moms a general edge in that respect. But at the end of the day, it really all comes down to the individual. I know of stay-at-home mothers who can be more negligent than an overworked working mother as well as working moms who are more of a suit than a mother. Stay at home mothers is really just another label as much as powersuit mamas are. A better question to ask oneself is whether they're truly being mothers. If the answer is yes...then regardless of whatever kind of role one plays...you'll always be a mother in the eyes of one's kids and that is something that money can never buy.
I ponder about this topic constantly...albeit from a somewhat different direction. I am by nature a consummate workaholic (or a work enthusiast as I prefer to term it). I constantly worry about whether I'll be first of all a good partner to my spouse and if I'll be a good father to my children. I know of lawyers who spend like an hour with their kids for dinner and come back straight to the office to carry on working. I can honestly see myself doing exactly that. I guess its one of those things that I'll find out once I'm in the thick of things =D
Thanks for asking such an engaging question =D And I hope you'll be able to find a great support network you can link in to =)
16 Feb 2008 11:30pm
@Wayne: Dear Wayne, thank you very much for taking time to write such a long reply to my question,i really appreciate it!And thanks for seeing my question as 'engaging',i do worry sometimes that i bore my blog visitors to death because my entries just revolve around the kids,me staying at home,and me staying at home,LOL. I do feel you are very mature for your age,and i am happy to say that i am not many years older,haha,at least thats what i tell myself when i see notices outside shops that say 'Salesgirl wanted. Ages 15-35'Then i'll be like,great,i am still eligible!
On a more serious note,i am very struck by what you said about how being a mother should transcend what she does for a living,whether she works or stays at home.And like you,i too, know of stay home moms who neglect their kids and working moms who are more involved in their kids' lives more than anybody else.I suppose all of us live under different circumstances and therefore i shouldnt judge anyone just as i do not wish anyone to judge me for making the decision to stay home.Please do not misunderstand that i was attempting to over-glorify the status of stay home moms,that they are more noble because they gave up their jobs and stuff.Like what you observed,what really counts is to be a mother at heart.And i totally respect working moms,simply because i was one after i had my first child,and i know the difficulties that working moms face.
Sometimes i think that i could be raising my concerns this way because i want to be assured that i am doing the 'right' thing,or rather,the best thing,by staying at home. And so i constantly seek justification for my decision to stay home.Perhaps one of the greatest reasons why i feel so strongly about mothers staying home is that i too,like you,am a product of a working mom.I am the youngest of 3 children,and i was fostered out to a nanny,to be exact,many nannies;till i entered primary school. I remember the abuse of being thrown naked out into the corridor,butter for lunch and overnight vegetables for dinner. Of being deposited at different places,whoever was available. Something etched deeply in my memory even till now was once,my sister held my hand and took me to my uncle's car outside our school.My sister told my uncle that i was to stay with him over the weekend,and i remembered his response very distinctly,in Chinese,'What,again?'Even though i was only 7 then,i felt the full rejection and angst that i seemed to be very 'extra',that i was a trouble to people and i had to go to whoever was available to take care of me.When i returned home permanently,i also felt the alienation from my siblings,simply because we have not lived together for 6 years,and suddenly we had to adjust to one another.
And so i was a delinquent at Primary school.My parents couldnt figure out why i was such a troublemaker,pick up fights with boys,flunk my exams,all kinds of vices which i am too embarrassed to share;so different from my siblings.But at the end of the day,my siblings and i all went to what you'd call 'elite' schools,junior colleges,and finally become professionals.So all's well ends well,you may think.But for the rest of my life,i have to live with the emotional scars of childhood experiences.However, having said that,i am grateful to my parents.They paid for my school fees,such that i didnt have the burden of having to pay for my debts when i started work,and maybe indirectly gave me the liberty to stay at home now that i have 2 kids,because i am debt free.Perhaps a part of me desperately want to give to my children what i didnt have,what i yearned for,and so staying at home was the clear option,even though we are now poor,even though it meant giving up the teaching profession which i love,and living with the fear that my kids may despise me for being a 'housewife'.And of course the criticisms of 'wasting' my many years of education only to stay home to clean poop,when i can go out there to earn my next big pot of money;of being lazy because i am at home and not at work[people who say this probably has never seen what hard work it is to take care of a toddler and a baby 24/7,with no relief,no money,no holidays,no bonus and no applause]
anyway,how did i get here?There i go ranting again,pardon me.Thanks again for visiting and sharing your views.:)
Hi Tyan,
I can totally understand your feelings. I used to work in the corporate world and after staying home for 4+ years, many people (who got to know me after I left to be a stay home mum) seem to think that I have never worked in my life, never brought home the dough, ...it can be very disheartening. And if you read my blog, my encounter with maids is so upsetting that I am terrified of hiring any more. There's not much help either, I am expected to pull off the whole show by myself. There are women in SG who also stay at home because they feel that hiring a maid is expensive, transport costs to work, extra expenses that come with work eg, lunch, presents for colleagues, work clothes etc....and the pay they get cannot match up to this. So they feel its cheaper to stay home and care for the kid for some years before they go back to work when kids are older.It is the system here that is rather rigid. Hang in there dear. Will continue to pray for you ok.
17 Feb 2008 12:06am
@Sue: Thanks dear Sue,for your kind encouragement. Ya,there seems to be this idea that moms who work are more 'useful'..I grew up with maids,so i know what you mean,getting a good maid is like buying lottery,in my opinion.There is a saying,out of ten times of gamble,you win once and lose the remaining 9 times.LOL.What u have said is true,i calculated that if i continued with my nanny to take care of my 2 kids,plus sending them to school,all my pay would have gone.No see children,no $ left also.But i suppose there is the 'freedom' to spend when u earn money and the respite you get from kids while you are at work.anyway,i think we should just do what is best for our family,with our spouse's support and blessing.I must learn to filter what people say.;)
I figured I'd return the favour of posting up my reply on your blog.
Dear Tyan, First of all, just to clarify, I never read your blog entry as one that was over-glorifying anything. In fact, I really understood and appreciated where you were coming from =) I think being a parent (and in particular a mother) is generally an unsung role and the role of a parent is a somewhat risky one...after all I feel the secret terror of a parent is that of a non-returning investment (to put it somewhat clinically). But I'm confident that no child can be blind to the kind of love that you must surely shower your kids with. Also on the point of your family providing for you financially but not emotionally is the distinction I was talking about between my maid taking care of me and my mom raising me. I think (given my limited experience and knowledge in this area) that sometimes a parent might find it easier to raise their kids by staying at home whilst others can work and still raise their kids. Different people are just built differently =). But if we're speaking opinion wise, I think your kids are darn lucky to have you as their mother and I (despite my limited qualifications to say so) think you're doing a fantastic thing. Like I was saying eariler...there is a distinction between merely taking care of your kids and raising them. I think you're doing an awesome job of both the former and latter in a world and a country that only seems to focus on the former. Cheers, Wayne
17 Feb 2008 7:06am
Hey sweetie, it's been forever......love the cookie photo, gosh I love Nutella :)
I had to return to work as I was a single mom! :)
17 Feb 2008 9:53am
I would eat some of those cookies right now.
In Jamaica times are hard and most persons are struggling to make ends meat. So there is hardly women who would quit their jobs after having a baby. The most they will do is take maternity leave up to 6 months.
17 Feb 2008 6:03pm
Hey tyanmoon..Unclebilly popping in... Hey pal,it's great to see Ian on his tootsies he'll be catching up to Caleb soon before you know it... On this question, all I can say is that when my anklebiters were old enough to be looked after by Unclebilly..Mrs.Billy went back to work part-time,and her hours were opposite to mine,so they benefited from parental care,however,we only seemed to pass each other as ships in the night ,but it gets better as they get older...so,in the end everyone benefits.. see you round like a doughnut pal.. Unclebilly...
17 Feb 2008 6:08pm
cookies in a nutella jar? was there nutella involved in the process of making the cookies? if yes, i want... ALL!!
mum's over here in australia seem to enjoy very good benefits. unpaid maternity leave up to 1.5 yrs (six weeks paid, i think, for civil servant). papa's too get paternity leave of 2 weeks. my figures are not exactly the most accurate ones given that i'm still single and all the info are from the pregnant mums floating around my office.
some mum comes back to full time work, while some choose part time work in order to take care of the baby. some can also negotiate to work from home. part time is great too as they can choose to work 9-3, 3 days a week, as oppose to 8-5, 5 days a week (full time). this is result in reduced in come, but then, this arrangement works better when the toddler in pre-school or school. that's the normal school hours over here. this is a move to encourage more mums to come back to work. australia is having major skilled labour shortage at the moment and they would like anybody who's capable of working to be working, even if it's only once a week or something.
i think mum's in australia is very priviledged. they have the ability to bring in the extra income, without compromising too much on family time. having said that, the child care centres are booming over here too with many choose to go back to work full time, leaving the kids to the child care centres.
17 Feb 2008 9:36pm
Thought I'd post my reply for here:
No worries =)
Blogging's one of the ways of expressing myself as well...I don't really expect people to read my thoughts...but I just need a place to let it all out so I completely understand you on that point =)
Stay awesome!
Wayne
18 Feb 2008 5:40am
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